PWG's "Fear of a Black Planet" on June 3, 2006!

Pro Wrestling Guerrilla Discussion

Moderators: PWG_Silverback, PWGTickets

Postby SoCalAndy » Thu May 25, 2006 12:50 pm

JeremyKC wrote:Colt Cabana and Am Dragon are more well-known than Kazarian and Perkins are. Kazarian got on WWE TV briefly, but Cabana and Am Dragon have huge followings, cause ROH is a giant.


This quote is hilarious on many levels. Cabana hasn't done as much as Kazarian has done in front of a mainstream audience, same for Danielson. Frankie has been on WWE TV for a month and got a good push when he was there, was on Comedy Central and had his name mentioned a few times, was on TNA for a year, appears in several nationaly sold DVDs for promotions like UPW. Cabana and Danielson haven't done as much to be exposed to a large amount of people. Ask any WWE mark at a WWE show if they know who is who and most likely they'll know more about Frankie than Colt or Danielson.

And ROH is hardly a giant.

Well, Perkins has wrestled in TNA which more people know than ROH. I'd say about 99% of ROH fans know about TNA but maybe 90% of TNA fans know about ROH.


This number is screwed up. Chances are every ROH fan knows about TNA, but there is no way 90% of the people who watch TNA know what ROH is. TNA lately has averaged about a million viewers. I highly doubt that around 900,000 people have heard about ROH, hell I doubt 100,000 people have heard about ROH. Now as for the Perkins argument.

Not only that, he also has wrestled in New Japan and CMLL. If only 5% of New Japan fans and 5% of CMLL fans know who Puma is then that adds a large number to his recognition. ROH is only a teeny-tiny percent of the wrestling market.


Not even. The numbers for New Japan have been dropping off, and he hasn't wrestled for in two years to my knowledge, and hasn't wrestled in CMLL for around three. Plus CMLL has atleast a hundred people on their roster, and TJ wasn't a star when he worked there. Chances are the people who have seen Perkins work in CMLL and NJPW don't even remember him, nor anyother person they saw on the same show as him sans the big names.

I'm so there...I'm looking forward to seeing what's next for the DYNASTY!!!


I hope they shit on your face.




This show looks good. I'm really bummed that Super Dragon wont be on the show, but Steen/Excalibur makes up for it. Plus I would like to see Cape Fear vs. Ronin and Koslov.
SoCalAndy
 
Posts: 1054
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:00 am
Location: Pasadena, California

Postby shyboy13 » Thu May 25, 2006 1:05 pm

Hey, I'll admit that my numbers are off. Perhaps they are way off. I just used approximations to make a point. If 2 or 3 percent of NJPW and CMLL fans know/remember who Perkins was that still adds to his recognition. I think we are saying pretty much the same thing though. I stand by my original statement that Kazarian, Perkins, and Sabin are more known than Danielson or Cabana.
shyboy13
 
Posts: 170
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:09 am

Postby SoCalAndy » Thu May 25, 2006 1:12 pm

I'll give you Kazarian, and maybe Sabin, but Perkins was not a huge player in NJPW or CMLL. Plus Danielson has done way more in NJPW than Perkins.
SoCalAndy
 
Posts: 1054
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:00 am
Location: Pasadena, California

Postby shyboy13 » Thu May 25, 2006 1:34 pm

SoCalAndy wrote:I'll give you Kazarian, and maybe Sabin, but Perkins was not a huge player in NJPW or CMLL. Plus Danielson has done way more in NJPW than Perkins.


Thats cool. None of us really KNOW the answer anyway. I am only going to ignore the others for right now and concentrate on Perkins versus Danielson. I will consider the 3 major wrestling markets: US, Japan, and Mexico.

US: I would say the edge goes to Perkins because of his exposure in TNA. There are more TNA fans than indy fans. I would say there are a lot more. Because of this, I would say that Perkins has had more exposure in the US than Danielson.

Mexico: Correct me if I
shyboy13
 
Posts: 170
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:09 am

Postby HeartPunch33 » Thu May 25, 2006 1:35 pm

I hardly think that Frankie K. got a good push. He was brought in by WWE and wasn't even used for 2 months before he finally was given a lame gimmic and wrestled 3 or 4 scrubs on Velocity and maybe once on Smackdown and then quit. However, as for the argument over who's better known, w/out question, it's still Kazarian due to his TNA work and the Cauliflower Alley Award that he received last year

As for the upcoming show, I just wish that people could call a spade a spade and not piss their pants over a show that appears on paper, to be quite subpar. I know, bah humbug, and yes, I know that any dissension in the chat room is frowned upon and is punishable by a furious and preposterously long rebuke by Sheriff SC Andy, so I'll leave it at that. The good news is that there will be plenty of good seats to choose from and maybe only 130 degrees instead of 150. [/quote]
HeartPunch33
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2005 3:55 pm

Postby SoCalAndy » Thu May 25, 2006 1:54 pm

I know that any dissension in the chat room is frowned upon and is punishable by a furious and preposterously long rebuke by Sheriff SC Andy, so I'll leave it at that.


Nah, it's been reduced to me laughing at you and calling you a fag on the board.

LOL@calling the people Frankie beat on Velocity "scrubs". Paul London is such a scrub bro, legit. Double LOL@anyone giving a shit about cauliflowers
SoCalAndy
 
Posts: 1054
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:00 am
Location: Pasadena, California

Postby onlxn » Thu May 25, 2006 2:43 pm

As to the overenthusiasm claim, I'm not expecting the show to be incredible (though I do think it'll be good). I'm mainly excited by the implications of booking a card like this. It shows two important things on the part of the PWG brass: faith in their regulars, and a commitment to the Dynasty angle. I regard both of those as really, really good things.

The star-studded shows have been really fun, but personally I think a more streamlined show is just what the doctor ordered.
onlxn
 
Posts: 630
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:07 pm

Postby WannaB » Thu May 25, 2006 3:40 pm

onlxn wrote:As to the overenthusiasm claim, I'm not expecting the show to be incredible (though I do think it'll be good). I'm mainly excited by the implications of booking a card like this. It shows two important things on the part of the PWG brass: faith in their regulars, and a commitment to the Dynasty angle. I regard both of those as really, really good things.

The star-studded shows have been really fun, but personally I think a more streamlined show is just what the doctor ordered.


It shows a third implication as well.

PWG wants to hold back on the spending so they can go all out for the 3 year anniversary show and BOLA '07. I'd expect the show inbetween the 3 year & BOLA to be a primarily local card just like this one.
User avatar
WannaB
 
Posts: 1342
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:22 pm

Postby HeartPunch33 » Thu May 25, 2006 3:54 pm

[Nah, it's been reduced to me laughing at you and calling you a fag on the board]

Before you go too far there honkeytonk man, spending an inordinate amount of your life on a wrestling chatboard makes you a bit of a fag, if you ask me (and I know you were asking me). The other thing I know is that you don't live nor have never lived anywhere near South Central so stop being a douche (or a fag) and make a point. If London is so great (with his tassled boots) I don't see why he is jobbing out on Velocity these days.
HeartPunch33
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2005 3:55 pm

Postby WannaB » Thu May 25, 2006 4:12 pm

HeartPunch33 wrote:If London is so great (with his tassled boots) I don't see why he is jobbing out on Velocity these days.


Because they're "shitcanning" him. :wink:
User avatar
WannaB
 
Posts: 1342
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:22 pm

Paul London=Tag Team Champion

Postby SoCalAndy » Thu May 25, 2006 4:21 pm

HeartPunch33 wrote:Bitching moaning failed attempt at trolling


Look pal, if you stop now I'll send you an 8x10 of me so you can jackoff to it k? This thread isn't a place for you to go on and on about some personal vendetta you have against me. If you want to make another thread dedicated to me, then by all means be my guest. Lets talk about PWG along with everyone else, ok? Good.

Sabin/Sky is going to be a fun match!
SoCalAndy
 
Posts: 1054
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:00 am
Location: Pasadena, California

Postby JeremyKC » Thu May 25, 2006 4:34 pm

WannaB wrote:
HeartPunch33 wrote:If London is so great (with his tassled boots) I don't see why he is jobbing out on Velocity these days.


Because they're "shitcanning" him. :wink:


He's one of the current tag champions. And MNM, who've been Smackdown tag champs forever, jobbed to London and Spanky for the last month.
JeremyKC
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 5:23 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Re: PWG's "Fear of a Black Planet" on June 3, 2006

Postby Evilguest » Thu May 25, 2006 4:38 pm

PWG_Silverback wrote:PWG's "Fear of a Black Planet" Takes Place on June 3!
By Silverback, PWG Staff Writer

Will Dallas air before or after, and on what night?


I'd *love* for them to come out to the actual theme from Dynasty.
User avatar
Evilguest
 
Posts: 367
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 10:18 am
Location: the pit of despair

Postby Aaron » Fri May 26, 2006 1:55 am

shyboy13 wrote:
SoCalAndy wrote:I'll give you Kazarian, and maybe Sabin, but Perkins was not a huge player in NJPW or CMLL. Plus Danielson has done way more in NJPW than Perkins.


Thats cool. None of us really KNOW the answer anyway. I am only going to ignore the others for right now and concentrate on Perkins versus Danielson. I will consider the 3 major wrestling markets: US, Japan, and Mexico.

US: I would say the edge goes to Perkins because of his exposure in TNA. There are more TNA fans than indy fans. I would say there are a lot more. Because of this, I would say that Perkins has had more exposure in the US than Danielson.

Mexico: Correct me if I
Image
Aaron
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 4:56 am
Location: England, UK

Postby shyboy13 » Fri May 26, 2006 8:13 am

I totally agree with the Puma vs Perkins thing. I even mentioned it briefly in an earlier post. If we only consider Perkins then I would say that Danielson has more recognition. However, if we take into account Perkins, Pinoy Boy, AND Puma then I would say Danielson has less recogniton.

I do disagree with 2 points you made though. The first is that more US fans know who Danielson is. I disagree almost entirely because of the exposure that Puma has had on TNA. Again, this is only true when we assume homogeneity of his various characters. Perhaps 99% of those who know who AD is in the US are internet marks. Probably 99% of internet marks know who Puma is. Basically, chances are great that if you know who AD is then you know who Puma is. The same cannot be said the other way around though. There are many TNA fans and casual viewers who are not internet marks and thus do not know who Danielson is. I think it is pretty clear that Puma has been more visible in the US.

The other thing I disagree on is that the European market is significant enough to make an impact. Again, we must subtract all those who know about both because they cancel eachother out. Anyway, the market is already small so once we subtract those who know about both we are left with a small subset of an already small number. I think you made a good point here but I just dont think the numbers are significant enough to make a difference.

Good post though!
shyboy13
 
Posts: 170
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:09 am

Postby ToddMartin » Fri May 26, 2006 8:22 am

That is a strikingly well done front page advertising this show. Really good stuff.
ToddMartin
 
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2006 8:36 am

Postby JeremyKC » Fri May 26, 2006 11:15 am

shyboy13 wrote:I totally agree with the Puma vs Perkins thing. I even mentioned it briefly in an earlier post. If we only consider Perkins then I would say that Danielson has more recognition. However, if we take into account Perkins, Pinoy Boy, AND Puma then I would say Danielson has less recogniton.

I do disagree with 2 points you made though. The first is that more US fans know who Danielson is. I disagree almost entirely because of the exposure that Puma has had on TNA. Again, this is only true when we assume homogeneity of his various characters. Perhaps 99% of those who know who AD is in the US are internet marks. Probably 99% of internet marks know who Puma is. Basically, chances are great that if you know who AD is then you know who Puma is. The same cannot be said the other way around though. There are many TNA fans and casual viewers who are not internet marks and thus do not know who Danielson is. I think it is pretty clear that Puma has been more visible in the US.

The other thing I disagree on is that the European market is significant enough to make an impact. Again, we must subtract all those who know about both because they cancel eachother out. Anyway, the market is already small so once we subtract those who know about both we are left with a small subset of an already small number. I think you made a good point here but I just dont think the numbers are significant enough to make a difference.

Good post though!


First off, you're making the European market seem way smaller than it is. The european market as a whole is bigger than the market in Mexico. There is wrestling all over Europe. It is hottest in the UK, but there are big promotions in Germany, France, Belgium, and other European countries. The European market is very significant, check out 1PW sometime and see how they bring in all of the American indy stars they do. They fly them in over the Atlantic and put them up in nice hotels. There is alot of money there, because they draw well.

I also think you underestimate how many people buy ROH DVD's and follow ROH. Just look at their message board. It's crazy. People from all over the world. They are touring all over the east coast into the midwest, performing in the Chicago and Detroit markets. Danielson also is Heavyweight champion in Full Impact Pro, the biggest indy in Florida. I'm not counting TNA as an indy, but what really has Puma/Perkins done in TNA lately? He was in the World X Cup, but casual wrestling fans probably don't even remember he was there.

Also, with Cabana. Another guy who is big in Europe. He also has worked EVERYWHERE in the midwest. He's worked the ROH markets. He's worked Florida. The guy works all over the place. I just think that some of you west coast people don't realize that there is wrestling beyond the coasts. It's starting to thrive in the midwest.
JeremyKC
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 5:23 pm
Location: Kansas City, MO

Postby shyboy13 » Fri May 26, 2006 12:35 pm

Wrestling is bigger in Europe (a whole continent) than Mexico? Wrestling in Mexico is bigger than any other place in the world. Japanese and US wrestling is not exactly the hottest things going right now. You are quite wrong about wrestling in Mexico. I also think you exadurate the importance of wrestling in Europe as well as the importance of ROH. You mention 1PW as it were a major fed. I dont think 1PW is even as big as ROH and ROH is not very big at all. It is just the 3rd biggest thing in the US but that does not make it very big when we consider feds like WWE, TNA, AAA, CMLL, NOAH, and NJPW. If 1PW is smaller than ROH and ROH is smaller than other large feds then that must mean that 1PW is, relatively speaking, a pretty small fed. Perhaps I am underestimatin the importance of wrestling in Europe but I seriously doubt it.

One more thing. Dont think that just because we live on the West Coast makes us blind to what happens in the wrestling world. From my experience, people at PWG shows are very knowledgeable about what goes on in wrestling. Some even attend shows on the East Coast and Mid West. We know that ROH is the 3rd largest wrestling company in the US. We also understand the importance of its influence and we dont think PWG is the only thing out there. We have access to the internet and books just like everyone else.
shyboy13
 
Posts: 170
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:09 am

Postby evilpaz » Fri May 26, 2006 12:36 pm

Mexico is a much much bigger market than the UK. 1PW is a small company compared to the likes of AAA, CMLL, Guerrerros del Ring, etc. These companies have TV shows on (I think) Galavision, which is a major Mexican television company. There's almost always an average of 10 shows EVERY weekend. That's why luchas wrestle the "lucha" style... because they work SO many dates that they have to wrestle in a way that doesn't cause TOO much wear and tear on the body.
evilpaz
 
Posts: 195
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:33 pm

Postby It's A Bomb » Fri May 26, 2006 4:12 pm

ROH is a giant.


The european market as a whole is bigger than the market in Mexico.


These two comments are some of the most delusional comments ever mentioned on this board.


The next show looks really good. The Dynasty angle at the last show was amazing and things should play out really well.
It's A Bomb
 
Posts: 203
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:07 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Pro Wrestling Guerrilla Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 3 guests